Syndicates, Sales & Singing with Simon Double

[00:00:00] Ben: Tell me, how does it work, racehorse syndication? 

[00:00:02] Simon: You’ve heard of somebody down the pub saying, “Oh, I’ve got a mate who- who’s got a leg of a horse.” And obviously, horses have four legs. My syndicates tend to have 12 legs. 12 shares is the maximum I do. I normally keep a share myself. I always buy horses who haven’t run before.

They tend to be yearlings for public auction, and sell the shares. I normally take the risk. I buy the horse without necessarily having owners lined up, and then they have a share in a horse for two years, so they get a share of the prize money, a share of the sale proceeds if and when the horse is sold.

But I’m always at pains to emphasize you do not do this to make money. If you’re fortunate and have a good horse, you can do, but that shouldn’t be your raison d’être for doing it.

[00:00:45] Ben: Before we dive into today’s episode, a quick word from our sponsors, and by sponsors I mean me, because Berko and Beyond is now proudly brought to you by Chuffed Productions, the video production specialists based right here in Berkhamsted. I know, I’m sponsoring my own podcast. I should have thought of it before, right?

So if you’ve got a challenge in your business that a video could help solve, we’d love to help. Head to our website, chuffed.video to get in touch. Now on with the show. Simon Double, welcome to Berko and Beyond. 

[00:01:14] Simon: Thank you very much. Thanks for having me on, Ben. 

[00:01:16] Ben: N- now, first thing I have to point out is, the sartorial gent that you are- 

[00:01:20] Simon: Oh, stop it

[00:01:20] Ben: normally I’ve never seen you without a shirt and tie on, but I have to point out that we are recording this episode in the middle of the heatwave, on the hottest day of the heatwave. 

[00:01:29] Simon: Well- 

[00:01:30] Ben: Hence w- we’ve gone casual and shorts. 

[00:01:32] Simon: I must admit, when I left my house about, I don’t know, half an hour, 40 minutes ago, I thought, “Surely he’s not gonna want me to turn up in a jacket and tie in this.”

Um, e- even the racecourses I think would relent. I’m not sure about Royal Ascot, but, uh, I think I’d get into most racecourses- I- … at the moment like this … 

[00:01:47] Ben: I was at Royal Ascot, uh, two years ago and was allowed to remove my jacket. 

[00:01:52] Simon: It must’ve… I reckon it must’ve been 85, 90 before they’d do that. 

[00:01:56] Ben: It’s crazy. Yeah. It was crazy, crazy hot. 

[00:01:59] Simon: What day did you go on, out of interest? 

[00:02:00] Ben: Uh, it would’ve been, uh, day after Ladies Day, I think. Friday. So the Friday, yeah. 

[00:02:06] Simon: Yeah. The purists, Tuesday’s the day to go. 

[00:02:09] Ben: Is that the day? 

[00:02:10] Simon: The, well, that’s the day that it has three Group 1 races, a Group 2. It’s a bit like the Cheltenham Festival.

People always say that Tuesday’s the best day to go. If you’re a racing aficionado or a racing nut, those are the best days. I mean, look, they’re all good. All, all days at Ascot are good, and all days at Cheltenham. But the Tuesdays on both meetings are the ones to go to, yeah. 

[00:02:28] Ben: Now, the reason we’ve dived straight into horse racing is ’cause, uh, for 30 years or more that has been your business, uh, uh, and in particular, uh, racehorse syndication, which, uh, I find fascinating, partly ’cause I know my mum and dad had a leg or a hoof of a horse at some point.  

[00:02:46] Simon: I remember you mentioning that, yeah. 

[00:02:47] Ben: Yeah, we had the jockey silks at one point. 

[00:02:49] Simon: Was it on the flat or the jumps?

[00:02:50] Ben: Uh, it was on the flat, I believe. I think. 

[00:02:52] Simon: Ah. Bet you can’t remember the trainer though, can you? 

[00:02:55] Ben: No, no, no. No. I mean, this is going back. 40 years, something like that 

[00:03:00] Simon:Any luck?  Did it do anything? 

[00:03:01] Ben: I think it might have won one or, or came close. I, I must ask, but to be honest, it, it’s a case of my mum would probably just make it up anyway and say, “Oh, yeah, it was brilliant.”

[00:03:10] Simon: Well, look, they say… I, I don’t know if this is really true or apocryphal, but the stat I’ve always been led to believe is that one in 10 racehorses that are born win a race. So if they had a winner, they’re quids in. They’ve done well. 

[00:03:22] Ben: That sounds good to me. So, um, tell me, how does it work, racehorse syndication? Because people do go, “What, sorry, I just own, own a leg?” Or, or how does that work? 

[00:03:31] Simon: Yeah, so the phrase I always use is you’ve heard of somebody down the pub saying, “Oh, I’ve got a mate who’s got a leg of a horse.” And, uh, you know, obviously horses have four legs. Um, my syndicates tend to have 12 legs, if you like.

Obviously not really, but, uh, 12 shares are the maximum I do. I normally keep a share myself, and increasingly I’ve gone into quarter shares as well. So they basically have… I, I always buy horses who haven’t run before. They tend to be yearlings, young horses that I normally buy myself at public auction, Newmarket, but I’ve been to Doncaster and Deauville in France in the past.

And then I sell the shares. So I, I normally take the risk, actually. I buy the horse without necessarily having owners lined up. Although if I’ve got existing owners, I might sound them out beforehand. And, um, and then they have a, a share in a horse, 12th share or quarter share for two years, and they make a couple of payments.

So I get billed by the trainer and the farrier. I have all those expenses, bed and breakfast as I call it, sort of feed and gallops. And then there’s racing expenses, transport, which is very expensive. Um, but they make, the owners who’re coming on board make one payment when they join, which covers their bit of the purchase, the 12th or the quarter, and the all-inclusive training fees for one year.

So I never go back to them. If the horse needs a scan or an operation, it’s all included. And then the second payment is for the three-year-old training fees. That’s a little bit less ’cause they’re no longer paying for the purchase. They get a share of the prize money, a share of the sale proceeds if and when the horse is sold, ’cause they might want to keep it on for a few more years.

But I’m always at pains, as everybody who knows me in Birmingham said, always at pains to emphasize you do not do this to make money. If you’re fortunate and have a good horse, you can do, but that shouldn’t be your raison d’être for doing it. Just prepen- pretend you’ve got 8, 10,000 pounds or whatever, and you’re just throwing it down a drain, and if any of it blows back up your way, happy days.

[00:05:31] Ben: Um, so I’ve thrown my 8, 10,000 pounds surplus lying around down the … But it, in all seriousness, it’s, there’s, it’s a bit of a lifestyle thing, isn’t it, as well? There, there’s- 

[00:05:42] Simon: It’s absolutely a lifestyle thing, and I put a lot of emphasis on hospitality. Not just hospitality when the horse runs at the racecourse, um, whether it’s home or indeed in France.

I’ve now got a syndicate horse who’s done very well in France. Maybe we can come onto that. But I do visits to stud farms, so Sheikh Mohammed’s stud, uh, Juddmonte Farms, a lot of the really top studs in Newmarket. I do trips to the Arc de Triomphe in October, which is, the Arc de Triomphe, the race that is, is Europe’s, you know, richest race, uh, attracting horses from all over the world.

So I’ll often do a three-day trip, and I’ll organize the hotels, the restaurants. I will be there for the three days, and again, it’s an all-inclusive package. So I put a lot of emphasis on the hospitality side, really because, A, people like that, and B, look, they might have a horse who’s useless. They might have a horse who’s injured.

I’m, I’m being really up front here. I remember Peter Harris, my first boss. This is what got me into horse racing. Well, my first job in racing was in ’94. Peter Harris, a very successful local businessman, but also a very good trainer. And, uh, I was one of several people who used to show people around to try and sell shares in the horses, and I can remember him saying once There was somebody coming round, and he happened to be around, and this prospective owner said, “Oh, you know, sort of, uh, I’m thinking of getting involved, maybe one or two shares.”

And Peter said, “You always need three horses,” he said, because he said, “One will be useless, one will be injured, and one hopefully will be giving you some fun.” And that, that’s stuck with me ever since, and it’s not actually that far off the truth. I’m not selling this, this syndication very well, am I, 

[00:07:17] Ben: Pete, really? I was just like, hang on. So what was, uh- I was, I was 8, 10 grand in, and, uh, I’m now nearly 30, ’cause I’ve got my, I’ve got my f- my three legs and my three different horses. Um, so what kind of people do it? Who d- who goes- Absolutely … who goes for it? 

[00:07:31] Simon: Absolutely all sorts, and I think that’s a reflection of people who go horse racing.

You know, traditionally it was always called the sport of kings. Um, but really, a- a- anybody… You need a bit of disposable income, I guess. Quite a, well, I’ve had quite a lot of retired people in the past, people who’ve sold their businesses. Um, I guess the sort of, y- you know, you’d think Berkhamsted quite, quite an affluent area.

I’d have loads of owners in Berkhamsted. But of course, those in their 30s and 40s, you know, they might have school fees. They might have all sorts of expenses. So you need some disposable income that you are prepared to lose. But, but equally, I’ve had people in their 20s get involved. Um, I’ve had a lot of women get involved, and not just, oh, it’s the husband and they’re like the appendage.

They have the share in their own right, and I think that’s partly because they’ve been attracted by the hospitality, uh, events that I put on, I think. 

[00:08:20] Ben: And it is a, it’s a real day out, isn’t it? That’s- 

[00:08:23] Simon: It, it’s fantastic. I mean, I was at Royal Ascot, um, I always go on a Tuesday, and it’s just, you know, they are the five best days flat racing in the world, attracting horses from all over.

Uh, it’s something we do very well. But look, there are 59 racecourses in Britain. Um, you talked about the heat earlier on. Actually f- yesterday, four meetings were canceled because of the extreme heat. But generally, there’s plenty of racing flat and jumps going on throughout, and lots of little courses, Plumpton.

I mean, Windsor’s very nice. Windsor has Monday nights, and they have lots of themed evenings. One thing that’s really, uh, taken hold of with racecourses is music. So after racing, there’ll be bands, you know, whether it’s going back to UB40 or Tom Jones does a lot. Apparently, he does Newmarket regularly on a Friday night, and he’s fantastic. Um, I think one of the first people to start it was Jools Holland, uh, at Newmarket. I think Newmarket’s one of the first courses. We’re going back quite a while now, and, uh, and it’s caught on with all the racecourses now. So it’s a good day out, six, seven races, and then often there’s music entertainment afterwards.

And if you take Windsor Racecourse, they actually theme their Monday nights, so they’ll have a Caribbean night, they’ll have a Ronnie Scott’s night. So in 

[00:09:33] Ben: a- There’s a Rum & Reggae, I believe. 

[00:09:34] Simon: Rum & Reggae, yes … which I’ve done. So I’ve organized coaches from outside Berkhamsted Cricket Club, and some of my owners, you know, uh, friends, family, people like yourself coming along, people who are members of the Chamber of Commerce. And, and again, I’ve, I’ve put the whole package together, and then they can have a bit of a boogie afterwards, yeah. 

[00:09:51] Ben: So you, you mentioned, uh, getting involved with, with horse racing 20-odd years ago, 30. It’s 30 years ago, right? So what- 

[00:09:59] Simon: So it was ’94 I got involved. In ’96 that I moved to Berkhamsted, yeah.

[00:10:03] Ben: Right. So what was the pr- what was the, the, the previous life before into the, into the horse racing? 

[00:10:08] Simon: So just prior to that, I was writing questions on television quiz programs, primarily Fifteen to One with William G. Stewart in the original. 

[00:10:16] Ben: I did not know that. 

[00:10:17] Simon: Did you not? I thought- 

[00:10:18] Ben: No, I didn’t know that. How did, how did I not know this?  

[00:10:20] Simon: And this is pre-computers, so in during the, uh, early ’90s, there would’ve been a half a dozen of us, guys and gals- 

[00:10:27] Ben: Yes … 

[00:10:27] Simon: sitting in a room over at Wandsworth and with electronic typewriters, typing out questions. And, uh, William G. Stewart was great. I mean, he was a producer. He produced

[00:10:37] Ben: I was gonna say, he, because he produced the show-  

[00:10:39] Simon: He hosted it as well … 

[00:10:40] Ben: as well 

[00:10:40] Simon: as, as well as hosted it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he, I mean, he produced Bless This House, and he was a director as well. I think he started off as a yellow coat at Butlin’s, as many of them did in those days. But we would all write questions, and we’d churn out between 50 and 80 a day, and we’d hand them in to William G. Stewart. He’s like the headmaster, and then he’d tick the ones that he liked, and then they’d get put on cards, and then they’d come back to the researchers, and then you’d have to find a second source to verify the question and answer married. So that’s what I did, and there was six of us doing that. 

[00:11:09] Ben: Hang on, so William G. Stewart- QA’d every single question that was on Fifteen to One? 

[00:11:16] Simon: Basically, yeah. I mean… he, so, so he, he would, he would look at them himself, and he decided what he… There was somebody who actually helped him- 

[00:11:24] Ben: Yeah … 

[00:11:25] Simon: compile the program, but he would be the ultimate arbiter as to what went in.Yeah. 

[00:11:28] Ben: Amazing. 

[00:11:29] Simon: Yeah, and it was, it was a serious quiz program. I mean, there was one trophy that was given for the winner of the grand final at the end of normally, I think, 65 episodes. So yeah, so I was a question writer, and I did Trivial Pursuit with Rory McGrath. I did various… I worked with, um, Jonathan Ross’s brother, Simon Ross as a producer on quiz programs. So yeah, I did that for quite a few years as, as a freelancer. 

[00:11:50] Ben: I can’t believe I didn’t know that about you. Brilliant. I love that. Um- 

[00:11:54] Simon: And before that, I was in marketing. I was four years in marketing, uh, uh, during the 1980s. So I’ve done quite a few varied things really.

[00:12:00] Ben: So was this a hobby then that turned into, uh, turned into a business? Were you, were you always into the horses? 

[00:12:07] Simon: No, not at all. I, I… Absolutely nothing. I think one of my grandfathers, who I never knew, ’cause uh, he sadly died when I was about one, but he did like a bet on the horses, but that is the extent really.

Oh, and actually on my dad’s side, this is my mom’s side of the family, my dad’s side of the family, there was a distant cousin, I think, who was a jockey. But to all intents and purposes, no. I liked it… You remember that, I think it was a 1998 film, Sliding Doors- Yes … with Gwyneth Paltrow and John Hannah? 

[00:12:32] Ben: Yeah.

[00:12:33] Simon: So my Sliding Doors moment was I was a member of a drama group in Chiswick, uh, during the 1980s, and I think it was the set of Guys and Dolls, I met a young lady called Shona, who was not into horse racing, but she was quite into horses. 

[00:12:49] Ben: Yeah. 

[00:12:49] Simon: And we started going racing. Well, we started going out basically and we went racing as one of the things we did, and I just got the bug. And I just decided I wanted to work in the racing industry. And I applied to an advert in the Racing Post, which was, Peter Harris had put it in. 

[00:13:06] Ben: Yeah. 

[00:13:07] Simon: And it was called the Winning Formula, which is how he branded his syndicates. And again, it w- it wasn’t a great sell.

It was, uh- Uh, “Do you mind working antisocial hours? Uh, are you sociable with people, and do you enjoy the racing industry?” And that was it. And I thought it was probably looking after owners, which it was, but actually there was a lot of selling involved as well which I’d never done really. I suppose I had done selling in terms of when I was a market researcher.

You know, you sell to clients. So i- in a roundabout way, I’d done a little bit of selling, but I’d never sold cars or any overt selling, anything like that. So that was my Sliding Doors moment. Had I not gone to that drama group, had I not met Shona- Well, I, I wouldn’t be sitting here talking to you about, uh, horse racing syndicates and- 

[00:13:49] Ben: You’d be talking to me about writing questions for The Wheel or something similar.

[00:13:54] Simon: Yes, yes. So, um, it, it’s funny, isn’t it, how you meet certain people at certain times, and your life c- can just take a completely different route. 

[00:14:03] Ben: And that, that route stuck, right? 

[00:14:06] Simon: Yes, so I, um, I was a question writer for, I guess, six, about six years on and off, a freelancer, and then I applied for this job, uh, this advert in the Racing Post in 1994, and got the job, and I was nine years with Peter Harris selling shares.

When Peter started, I guess there were… He had 60-odd horses in training, maybe 70, 80 owners. By the time I left in 2003, there were six of us, partnership managers we were called… and he must have had 400 owners, well over 100 horses in training. Wow. He really pioneered syndication, and, you know, he’s a very successful businessman, and he used his…

I think he was an accountant originally. But he used those business principles for syndication, and if you talk to people who’ve been in racing a long time, whether they’re trainers or jockeys, you know, people will often cite Peter Harris as the person who really moved syndication on. 

[00:15:01] Ben: So what made you want to strike out on your own and, uh, start your own syndication?

[00:15:08] Simon: Well, I suppose it’s like a lot of things. You do… I d- I would say in nine years, and, and I quite fancied the idea of working for myself. So I actually set up Pat Eddery Racing with Pat Eddery and his wife, Carolyn. And, um, again, another fortuitous moment I didn’t realize, I’d been a big fan of Pat as a jockey.

He was somebody I used to follow. He used to have trebles and four-times. I used to go to Windsor races a lot before I got into the industry, and you could almost back Pat blind at, at, you know, at his peak. And, um, but fortuitous moment, he, um, he was going to retire, uh, in 2003, and, um, obviously he and his wife Carolyn wanted him to do something else.

Anyway, long story short, we set up Pat Eddery Racing, and I was there a few years and then set up my own company, Solario Racing, in 2010.  

[00:15:59] Ben: And where does the name Solario come from? 

[00:16:01] Simon: There is quite a nice narrative about that. So, okay, it was originally called Jamacita Racing, and I’ll tell you the reason for that.

I was approached by some owners who I knew from Pat Eddery’s, and they, they approached me. They all had other jobs, but they thought this was a good way to earn some extra money.

Well, I’m not so sure about- Which we’ve already covered is I’m not sure about that. But they wanted me ’cause I was a syndicate professional to sort of head it up really. And Jamacita was ’cause they took their names, J-A for Jason, A-M-A for Malcolm, S-I for Simon, T-R for Troy. Anyway, we, we had this company for a year and a half and I said, “Listen, this name has gotta change because people are thinking genuinely it’s an Indian restaurant when they ring up and, uh, you know, Jamacita Racing. So, um- I then actually, we did change the company name before I bought them out, and Solario was a very good horse in the 1920s, owned by some, what you call toffs in those days. But it was a very small syndicate, and Solario was a syndicate of four people, the Earl of Roseberry, or people like that.

And he was a very successful horse and a very successful stallion. So I thought Solario, there you go. There, he was one of the very first syndicate horses. So there you go, Solario Racing. And then, um, within two or three years, um, the other guys, I think they realized this wasn’t a quick way to earn a lot of extra money.

So basically, I bought them out and, and went off on my own, uh, with Solario Racing, and we’re still going.  

[00:17:32] Ben: And telling people that they’re not gonna get any money out of it, but it’s, it’s a, it’s a good giggle, and it’s a, a good social, and- 

[00:17:39] Simon: It’s lovely. And look, it’s not, you know, I’m never gonna be a, a multimillionaire running Solario Racing and, you know, just like the, I’ve said about people getting involved, um, shouldn’t expect to make money.

But it’s, it’s … I’ve been very privileged to do something I really enjoy. Met some fantastic people along the way, owners and … But of course, you can imagine, I’ve met all sorts of jockeys and trainers, and, um, I’ve really been so lucky. Amy Murphy, who’s a trainer, a young trainer who was in Newmarket, she realized that actually, uh, there was more prize money to be made in France, ’cause their whole structure out there is very different.

So last year she set up in Chantilly, which is the equivalent of Newmarket. A lot of the good horses are trained in Chantilly. And her husband took over the operation. Uh, Lemors he was originally a jockey. Um, they met actually at Luca Cumani’s, a trainer in Newmarket. But anyway, uh, Lemors then took out a trainer’s license, so they split the operation.

So currently I have two horses in Newmarket, and one with Amy at Chantilly. And the French horse has done fantastically. I mean, he’s run nine times since last September, and he’s won two races. Amazing. He’s won 90,000 euros. I’ve seen him run every time, and importantly, he’s a quarter share syndicate. The owners have been to see him as well, which has been lovely.

So I’ve not been Johnny No-Mates watching it on my own most of the time, which has been great. Um, and you know, fair play to Amy for a young trainer taking that initiative to do that. 

[00:19:06] Ben: And that is a beautiful part of the world. I’ve been there as a, as- It’s lovely. Chantilly Racecourse- Chantilly. 

[00:19:08] Simon: The racecourse is-has the chateau… on, on the f- you know, the back straight. And, uh, as well as the chateau, there’s an equestrian building there, um, where they have slight dressage as well. I mean, it is absolutely stunning. I think actually a few years ago, Chantilly was threatened with being closed. But what’s astonishing about French racing is apart from the really big days, and I did have a big day just over a week ago at Chantilly when, um, Victoire Magique, so he’s a French-bred horse- Um, and he ran in, he was in a group race, a group three, and he was second.

It was fantastic. Um, but what is, what is great about French racing is their structure is very different, so there’s a lot more prize money. But apart from the big days, that, that was a big day. That was their… We have the Derby and the Oaks, so the Oaks is for three-year-old fillies. They have the Prix de Diane.

That was packed that day. But generally, when I’ve been going, uh, and the Arc de Triomphe is another big meeting. But generally, when you go French racing, so when Victoire Magique ran down at Lyon last September on his debut, I kid you not, the grandstand, there was me Uh, one owner who came and a French broadcaster, who actually interviewed me afterwards because the horse won, there was nobody else in the grandstand.

The only people there were, well, a few hard and diehard punters… but mainly stable lads, owners, and trainers. The French just generally don’t go racing, but they do bet in the Tabacs. So a bit like people buying lottery tickets-… they will do all sorts of exotic bets, and a lot of the money gets funded back, goes thr- thrown back into racing and supporting prize money.

Uh, the other great thing about having a French-bred horse is during the first two years, as well as the prize money is already better, if it wins or gets placed, because it’s French-bred, you get an extra 75%. 

[00:21:02] Ben: Sorry, 75%- 75%. Because it’s French-bred? 

[00:21:05] Simon: Yes, 

[00:21:05] Ben: yes. 

[00:21:06] Simon: Because it’s French-bred. So it’s the French way of actually promoting their French breeding industry. So you can see why Amy’s gone out there… and, and, you know, if you don’t have a French-bred, the prize money’s better anyway. Sorry, I’m not doing a very good job of selling British racing. But, but prize money is a sore point… for anybody who’s in racing. Uh, but the French is better anyway, and they’ve got this fantastic 75%.

And I’ve been really fortunate enough to have a, a, a really good horse who’s done very well. Um- 

[00:21:32] Ben: So fr- from a business point of view, because this is an, an investment to start with and the returns on it come from, come from winnings, h- how do you go about structuring your o- your, your own business and … 

[00:21:47] Simon: So within the share price that I charge them, I’m building in an amount for me running the syndicates basically. And then also at the end of the period, um, when the horse is sold, I would take a small percentage of the sale price-… before divvying up all of their shares as well. And as I said, I also keep a leg, but I don’t rely on that to actually, um, give me an income. I include an income in the share price, um, when I’m selling the shares.

[00:22:14] Ben: And as far as … So you’ve, you’ve got … I’m j- … I guess what I’m getting at is it’s kind of, there’s you, obviously you’ve got everyone else, but it all, all kind of comes back to you, you in the end. Is it sometimes a bit of a lonely place being the, being the syndicate? 

[00:22:29] Simon: Um, well, I suppose basically I’m doing the buying of the horses, I’m doing the selling of the shares, uh, doing my own marketing, putting on hospitality events.

It can be, but I think to compensate for that, and as you know, Ben, I do quite a lot of networking. Yes. So, uh, partly it’s a way, and I have … You know, I’ve got owners on board, not just coming to hospitality events like at Windsor Racecourse, but I’ve actually got people who’ve ended up having shares in racehorses.

Um, it’s been a very slow burn, and I always say it’s a slow burn. And it’s a very, very soft sell. I mean, I’m not being funny, you don’t need a share in a racehorse, do you, really? It’s gonna be bottom of your shopping list. 

[00:23:03] Ben: Yes. 

[00:23:04] Simon: But do you know what? In Australia … Uh, so I run a podcast called Inside the Rails, and we had a lovely guest on called Francesca Cumani, who you might have heard of, who’s one of the ITV’s big- presenters, and she started off her broadcasting career in Australia.

And we were interviewing her, and she says, and I quote, she said, “I think I’m right, Simon. One in 180 people in Australia has a share in a racehorse.” 

[00:23:28] Ben: Really? 

[00:23:29] Simon: Because the prize money is fantastic, and they do it as an investment They do, yeah. I mean, that is absolutely astonishing. Um, you know, the, the British racing scene would bite your hand off for anything like approaching that statistic. Yeah, one in 180. Um- 

[00:23:45] Ben: So talk to me about Berko. How did you end, how did you end up here, and, uh, y- you- Simon … are a well-known face on, on, on the- … on the networking scene. 

[00:23:54] Simon: Well, I came to Berko because it was a job with Peter Harris, so based in Tring. So I was two years, I’d moved back home, um, to try and save up to, to get my first house.

Um, but I’m a Northwest London boy, so I spent my childhood in East Acton, went to school in Hammersmith, and the family home was in Perivale. But then I moved to Berko in ’96 when I realized these, these really were antisocial hours. Peter Harris was absolutely right. He wasn’t joking. We were on the phone at 7:00, 8:00 in the evenings, you know.

So he would place adverts, so it wasn’t cold calling. We would, we’d be ringing people who’d responded to an advert wanting to get involved. But we spent a lot of our time booking appointments and then showing them round. And, and a visit would take two hours. I mean, it was, Peter Harris’ setup then was huge. Um, so I needed to be nearer the job, so I moved to Berkhamsted in ’96, and I’m still here. 

[00:24:48] Ben: Um, and talks… And we’re, I’m j- we are, we’re, we’re being trivial about the networking, but, um, there are some brilliant networking groups in, in Berko. There are. Y- you know them all. 

[00:24:58] Simon: Well, 

[00:24:59] Ben: I, I’m, I’m- So not, not that we’re gonna call out any, any by name, but, uh, it’s a great scene, isn’t it?

[00:25:06] Simon: It is. I have been likened, and I shan’t mention the person who called me a networking tart once, which, which caused great hilarity. Um, so I’m not sure if I can say that. Anyway, I’ve said it now. 

[00:25:17] Ben: Well, you have now.  

[00:25:17] Simon: I’ve said it now. Um, so but I knew what, what this person meant. So yeah, you, you’ve gotta be selective with networking, but there are some lovely groups. Did you say we can’t mention the names? 

[00:25:26] Ben: No, we can mention, we can call, call them out. 

[00:25:27] Simon: Yeah, so the Hospice of St. Francis is a fantastic- Of which we’re both members … and I’ve been a member of that for many, many years. And, um, not only is the charity a great charity, we all know hospices are suffering, getting less funding from the government, but the networking events are absolutely lovely.

Um, Karen Addis- Carolyn Addison was there. Um, she was the one who introduced me, and then she retired, and you’ve got Claire Larkin now… who’s one of the main fundraisers. They do a great job. One lovely group that I belong to, obviously, there’s the Berkhamsted Chamber of Commerce, which you and I both know.

Um, but the Dacorum Lunch Club, which is run by EIC Insurance, which I think I’ve sort of introduced you to relatively recently. And they meet every couple of months at a, a restaurant. It’s always a lunch. Um, but the highlight of the year is what they call a cultural exchange. I’m not sure there’s any exchange involved I, well, we- And I’m not sure there’s much culture involved … 

[00:26:25] Ben: We did have this conversation the other day. It is getting on a train, having a drink, getting off the train- Or two, or three … yeah, or t- two or three. Well, I didn’t sit down on ei- either direction on the… I didn’t leave the buffet car of the Eurostar. That’s what you’ve done to me. Um, on the, on the last train. I didn’t make this year’s, thankfully. My, my, uh…

Well, my liver thanked me afterwards, anyway. It… There’s not a lot of cultur- cultural exchange as far as meeting anybody, uh, French or Belgique, uh, depending on w- which side you get on. 

[00:26:56] Simon: Well, you meet plenty of waiters and bar staff. 

[00:26:57] Ben: There is that. But it’s, spending a whole day with people is always gonna be A, fun, and B, you get to know them better, right? 

[00:27:04] Simon: Joking aside, yes, it is a bit of a, you know, a drink fest, but we d- we do eat as well. 

[00:27:09] Ben: Yeah. 

[00:27:09] Simon: Um, but what is lovely, you do get to spend a lot of time in a very informal, um, environment. I mean, this year we went to Brussels and there were 20 of us. Previously, I think it was 30 is about the maximum ago.

Gone to Eurostar fairly early, and it’s, uh, normally Lille or Brussels. And one year went to Paris, and actually I’d been to France a lot, uh, over the years. Never been inside Notre Dame, and I managed to… ‘Cause we did have a bit of spare time. Went inside Notre Dame, and it was the year that three or four days later it burned down.

[00:27:39] Ben: So perfect timing. 

[00:27:41] Simon: So, uh, really lucky. Obviously, it’s been rebuilt now, which is fantastic. But, uh, so no, it’s, it’s a really good group and a very friendly group, and it’s a lovely way to get to meet people, and people genuinely do cement business relationships and friendships through it. So yeah, I mean, there’s two or three networking groups that I’ve mentioned.

I’ve been to others along the way, but, um, they’d be ones I’d give a, a shout to. And also Radens Solicitors, who, who I know you and I know very well. They run various networking groups as well, so fair play to them. 

[00:28:09] Ben: Now, um, away from the, uh, networking, or is it away from the networking? Let’s find out.

You’ve, you’ve started another business. It’s, you know, one’s, one’s not enough, let’s do something else. I, of course, it’s related because it’s, it’s entertainment, but- 

[00:28:25] Simon: It, it is. Etoile Events. So when all of my college peers, uh, you know, are all long retired and, and putting their feet up and, you know, traveling the world and stuff, I decided one business wasn’t enough.

And, um, so I co-run, uh, with a good friend of mine, Nicola Langlands, um, Etoile Events, which is… I’m very passionate about music, so horses and music are the things really for me, and, um, particularly into jazz. And we set up Etoile Events last year, and we find a venue, either a church or a, or a local village hall.

Uh, we get some A-list musicians. We’ve done mainly jazz so far, but we’re branching out. Uh, book the venue, book the act, book the sound people. Often we lay on food, we run the bar, we do the whole lot, we promote it, and there’s always a charity angle as well. So although Etoile Events is a commercial company, and I make no apology for that, there’s always a charity angle.

We always run a, a charity raffle. Um, the events are in Berkhamsted where I am, or over in Epping where Nicola is, and in Berkhamsted we tend to raise money for Gad’s Hill Place Riding for the Disabled, which is a, another charity close to my heart. 

[00:29:34] Ben: Talk to me a little bit about, uh, about that charity, because I know you do, you, you do a lot for them, and like you say, it is very close to your heart. 

[00:29:40] Simon: Well, I do quite a lot of fundraising for them. I was a trustee for two, two and a half years, but then even I realized that you, you can spread yourself a bit thin. But I think, um, I’d like to think they get more out of me, actually, by doing fundraising, um, than, than being a trustee. Um, it’s a lovely little charity, and unlike other charities who are able to pay f- you know, corporate fundraisers, they don’t.

I think they employ two, three staff, and they’re the people who look after the ponies and run Gad’s Hill Place. So it’s fairly local. Um-… Gad’s Hill Place RDA, and it’s a brilliant charity, primarily children’s, some adults, who’ve got a whole range of disabilities, but the power that riding ponies, and they are ponies, um, can give to them, um, i- is fantastic.

And it… I think the important thing, s- thing is it gives a, a, at least an hour’s respite, maybe half an hour, depending on the length of lesson, to the parents. Because some of these children do have, you know, really quite extreme autisms and disabilities, and it’s just… That’s what struck me. It just must be absolutely exhausting, really.

Obviously, the parents love their children to bits, but actually 24 hours You know, coping with their many needs, but the, the riding just gives them a little bit of respite, and it’s a fantastic charity. Uh, really it keeps going through volunteers and fundraising and, uh, the trustees who are there, the volunteers, everybody does a fantastic job.

And I will actually give a mention to a lady called Karen Gosen, um, who actually was a trustee. And I went to a networking, funny enough, breakfast at Berkhamsted-  

[00:31:21] Ben: You met someone at n- uh, yeah, okay … 

[00:31:22] Simon: Berkhamsted Golf Club, and she stood up and said, “Oh, we’re looking…” This is a few years ago. “We’re looking for people to maybe get involved and be a, be a trustee.”

Um, I teased Karen about it. I didn’t realize at the time. I became a trustee. I didn’t realize she was stepping down, and it was beautifully managed by her. But anyway, she’s a great strength, source of strength to Gadsden Place, and we do a lot of fundraising together. So, um, I just wanted to give her a mention because she’s somebody who hides her light under a bushel and, um, just quietly gets on with things. But she’s, she’s a great person. 

[00:31:54] Ben: Brilliant, fantastic. Great mention there. Tell me then, Berkhamsted, what do you love about the area s- so much? What… Obviously, you stayed because of the job originally. 

[00:32:05] Simon: Yeah, but I think, uh, look, it’s a combination of the people in Berkhamsted, the history. Um, we’ve got fantastic countryside.

Obviously, you’ve got what’s left of the castle. Um, you’ve got a lovely cinema. You’ve got lovely restaurants. But I, i- it, you know, a place can be fantastic, but if it hasn’t got nice people… There are some lovely people, and you’re one of them. But there, there are, there are lots of really lovely people doing all sorts of interesting jobs.

And I suppose, yeah, I, I, I guess I sort of work hard and play hard a bit really, and it’s, there’s just so much to do here. It’s lovely. And you’re half an hour from London as well, so, you know, half an hour from Euston. So, uh, again, very, very lucky and privileged to, to live in a place like this. I’m not sure now if I was starting off on the property ladder I’d be able to afford Berkhamsted, if I’m really honest.

[00:32:50] Ben: I think there, there’s many of us in that boat. 

[00:32:52] Simon: But I, I got in in ’96, so I think it was at the bottom of one of those property cycles… and I was fortunate, very lucky. So yeah, it’s a lov- lovely town. 

[00:33:00] Ben: And what’s next? What’s next for you? Because surely there’s something on the cards. There’ll be an event of some description, or there will be a- 

[00:33:06] Simon: So I, I mentioned we’ve been doing primarily jazz events, but um, uh, Nicola and I went to a Simply ’60s, uh, night, um, a few months ago. It was a charity event over in her neck of the woods. And, um, I went and approached the drummer and… But they also do ’70s and ’80s and other things, so the next one will be in the autumn at Northchurch Social Centre, which will be a, a ’70s night where you can, you know, dress up in your platforms and your flares.

And we’ll be providing retro ’70s food, and, uh… But it’ll be a great chance- … to dance to some really, really good music. So we’re branching out. Just what, you know, jazz is a bit niche. And also you’ve got things like Berkhamsted Jazz Society, so you’ve gotta be a bit, you’ve gotta be a bit cute when you’re putting on events, um, so that, uh, you can attract, attract people and, and, you know, make a little bit of money.

Um, but I suppose the other thing I should mention, Choir on the Green is a, a big part of my life as well. And, um, in fact, I had a rehearsal this morning. I’ve become a choir addict really. 

[00:34:06] Ben: Well, you have because, uh, we record these podcasts, uh, usually on a Friday, and we batch record them. It’s no, no secret, two or three.

And, uh, Simon’s been singing, not been able… It’s been taking weeks, months to get you on- … on the podcast. 

[00:34:21] Simon: It’s- Uh, 

[00:34:22] Ben: t- tell us, but tell us about it, ’cause it is, it, it is a fascinating choir. Um- And I, you know, brings so much joy to many people. 

[00:34:31] Simon: It’s brilliant. So Nicola, um, uh, who I run into events with is a member of Rock Choir, and that’s fantastic.

It’s a nationwide choir, and I’ve been to many of their gigs and, and, and brilliant, really brilliant. What’s different about Choir in the Green is it’s an independent choir run by a very talented guy called Paul Bullen, who started off in TV. He was… His background was with Big Brother. Uh, I think he started off as a runner and ended up being one of the producers on there.

Uh, but he’s also a very talented, uh, arranger and pianist and, uh, I think he’s been on tour with people like Mel C as well. Uh, but he set up Choir in the Green. We had a 10th anniversary last year. I’ve been a member for two and a half years. And, um, we rehearse. We’re based on Ashley Green, and most rehearsals are done there.

And I go to rehearsals on a… now on a Monday, two on a Tuesday back to back, one on a Friday. Most people are sensible, and they go once or twice a week. But I, I go several times. Part of the reason for that is it’s a good way actually of learning the songs. I’ve not got to spend so much time at home. But actually, again, it’s the sociable side of things.

And what’s… And we do charity gigs. So Paul never charges for his time at gigs. Um, so we’ve done, uh, raising money for the Hospice of St. Francis, Gadston Place, the Ynor Trust, all sorts of great charities. Dens, we did a big gig for Dens the other day at Berkhamsted Girls School. And, uh, so we’re having fun singing Meeting lots of new friends and raising money for some great causes.

And for me, what is fantastic is the arrangements. So we do everything from, um, Radiohead to John Denver to Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart. Um, yeah, Bon Jovi. I mean, all sorts of things. 

[00:36:14] Ben: I’m not surprised you need the four rehearsals to learn the, to learn the songs. 

[00:36:18] Simon: And, um, and it, and it’s great. Uh, just the humor.

The other thing is Rock Choir is fantastic, but things like that, they’re a little bit formulaic. I think by their very nature they have to be. But Paul, because he’s, it’s his choir, um, he can run it how he wants. And, um, the choir, I’ve been a member for two and a half years, it’s mushroomed in terms of people who go along.

But, um, it’s just great fun. And, uh, you know, he knows every single person’s name, which is amazing. People come in, maybe come in two or three minutes late, and he’ll welcome them and, you know, he knows every single person. And we’ve got sometimes 170, 180 of us singing at one gig. So, uh, and sometimes it’s 40 of us.

And we play at some lovely churches. We’ve done St. Albans Abbey. Um, we’ve done, I said, St. Peter’s Church. Um, this coming weekend we’re doing Ashley Green, so where we basically, near where we rehearse is the Ashley Green Village Fair. Brilliant. And I think we follow the dog agility competition. So, um, you know, it, it, it’s just lovely.

Really, really good fun. And singing is great. I mean, it sound- sounds a bit cliche, but singing is, is great for your physical and mental health. I know it gets trotted out a lot, but it definitely has. So I was quite lucky. As a kid I learned the piano and clarinet, and never thought I had much of a voice, but, um, I’m still not sure I have, but, but I- 

[00:37:39] Ben: Well, it’s hidden by the other 179 other people next to you, right?

[00:37:41] Simon: Well, ab- abso- absolutely. But, uh, it, it’s lovely. Really, really great fun, and I can’t recommend joining a choir enough. 

[00:37:48] Ben: Brilliant. Um, uh, it feels like, I wouldn’t say we’ve come full circle, but we’ve certainly come from, uh, Ascot to Ashley Green. Uh- I like it. So it feels like a good place to say, Simon Double, thanks for joining us on the Berko & Beyond Podcast.

It’s been a real pleasure chatting to you. 

[00:38:05] Simon: Thanks very much, Ben. Thanks again for having me on. Thank you. 

[00:38:08] Ben: Thanks for watching this week’s episode of Burco & Beyond. If you’d like to be a guest on the show, then drop us an email, podcast@burcoandbeyond.com. And don’t forget to like and subscribe wherever you watch or listen to your podcasts.

We’ll see you next week.